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Post by angelobryant on Nov 21, 2007 14:33:50 GMT 8
How do I improve on longs climbs like 15 km long gradual (about 12-15 degree grades) I often find my self stopping very often and catching my breath on these long climbs. Please help
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Post by anthrax76 on Nov 21, 2007 14:55:09 GMT 8
hmm....learn for LA...he he he spin on lower gears
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Post by angelobryant on Nov 21, 2007 15:14:26 GMT 8
what about muscle endurance?
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Post by arcireyes on Nov 21, 2007 16:36:54 GMT 8
my personal take on this question (and i hope i am right):
there is only three things to do:
1. practice 2. practice 3. and....more practice
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Post by yukon on Nov 21, 2007 16:43:03 GMT 8
granny or dismount and Push Push Push...granny works for me, sometimes ;D
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oyo6u
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Digos Trail Biker
Posts: 80
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Post by oyo6u on Nov 21, 2007 17:22:10 GMT 8
1. heart rate management 2. cadence 3. patience 4. don't look up! (sometimes it helps not knowing what's ahead - I guess) hehehe ;D
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Post by Aaronchicharon on Nov 21, 2007 19:51:01 GMT 8
i'd say practice and perseverance... i used to dismount at cardiac(sta rosa) at least once or twice... now, on normal dry or not so muddy conditions i've been able to conquer it and am ready for the next level of pain... reverse palace, hope to be able to try this soon.
contrary to what oyo6u said in #4... i look up to gauge how far i have to push so that i can conserve my energy... and i always tell myself in my mind "konti na lang... konti na lang... konti na lang..." even though i know i still have a long way to go hehehe.
another good way is to ride along with a strong rider... that way you'll be challenged.
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Post by marcs on Nov 21, 2007 19:54:20 GMT 8
several things 1.) mindset . . . tough mind will take you to the top 2.) endurance . . . you just got to put in the base miles no other way around it. climb climb climb 3.) proper pedalling technique . . . for optimum power output 4.) increased LT (lactate threshold) . . . do intervals 5.) strengthen core muscles via crunches . . . again for optimum power output 6.) proper balance . . . if you're slipping and sliding you're wasting power
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Post by Freeman on Nov 21, 2007 20:02:13 GMT 8
On long climbs.. just be patient and stick to the gears where you are comfortable, too hard or too soft gearing can exhaust your muscle easily.
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Post by allegra on Nov 21, 2007 20:03:32 GMT 8
what about muscle endurance? Long , low intensity rides build endurance
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Post by dayuhan on Nov 21, 2007 20:22:10 GMT 8
my personal take on this question (and i hope i am right): there is only three things to do: 1. practice 2. practice 3. and....more practice Got to agree. Practice builds your legs and lungs, and you need those for climbing. It also builds your technique. You learn to pedal more efficiently, you learn to manage your gears more effectively, and you build a mental comfort zone around the idea of climbing. An awful lot of it is in your head. I ride in a place where you climb a lot, and there are climbs that used to scare me that I now look forward to. Part of it is getting stronger, but a lot of it is just in knowing what you can do and how to do it. If you're on platform pedals, try going clipless. It does make a difference. Also make sure your seat isn't too low, and that your weight isn't too far back on the bike.
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Post by BrusKO on Nov 21, 2007 21:01:29 GMT 8
You've got to learn to love the pain. Yagitnabiker couldn't be more right. Go with riders stronger than you. A little friendly competition would be fun from time to time.
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Post by g.b.b on Nov 21, 2007 21:10:05 GMT 8
the saying goes..... no pain, no gain
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Post by jr on Nov 21, 2007 22:33:41 GMT 8
Aside from strenghten your core muscles. Do lots of long hills climb.
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Post by Ben Dover on Nov 21, 2007 23:01:48 GMT 8
uhm...i think even the strongest climber will find himself catching his breath if he'll try to get to the top as fast as he could...i wud say it all depends on what you want to achieve...you want to get there looking fresh like newly bathed baby, then take it easy and maintain you cadence (not speed) as if you're just on a flat terrain...once on top, splash some baby cologne. ;D you want to get there ahead of the pack with your same fitness level, take it slow and easy in the beginning...you can even use one gear lower than you wud normally use and let them get ahead of you in the first half..dont worry you'll catch them later somewhere near the middle...then slowly shift to the gear you're most comfortable with ( you'll be riding side by side with them by this time)...near the end, tantyahan na yan...if you think you can get to the top at max sustained effort then do it. now if you just want to be a better climber and top your previous record, then i guess you already knew what to do...i think they already said it all above. ..and always remember..according a famous cyclist "it don't get easier, you just get faster". happy climbing
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Post by Aaronchicharon on Nov 22, 2007 0:21:30 GMT 8
15km climb? tempting... where is that located?
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Post by angelobryant on Nov 22, 2007 16:02:02 GMT 8
ah, i was talking about the baler route we did previously, but my latest experience humbled me much much more than that mountain. I'm talking about mt. sto tomas in baguio. It's only 8 km and it doesn't look too dounting at first. But the combination of unfamiliar terrain and thin (thinner than in my place) air did me in. I was catching my breath all the way up. At first, I was able to sustain a decent pace... as I reach the half way mark, kaboom... I just flipped. From there on, it was like an interval session. Hataw for half a minute, then rest. tsk tsk tsk It took too much time to recover my breath, longer than the usual. Later, I tried to maintain a slow pace, but nonetheless, I was still panting like crazy. No other choice but to hammer and rest. It was like that until I reached the top.
I will comeback to that mountain! Promise!
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Post by Aaronchicharon on Nov 22, 2007 16:17:14 GMT 8
yikes! + the cold weather...
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Post by Freeman on Nov 22, 2007 20:30:38 GMT 8
uhm...i think even the strongest climber will find himself catching his breath if he'll try to get to the top as fast as he could...i wud say it all depends on what you want to achieve...you want to get there looking fresh like newly bathed baby, then take it easy and maintain you cadence (not speed) as if you're just on a flat terrain...once on top, splash some baby cologne. ;D you want to get there ahead of the pack with your same fitness level, take it slow and easy in the beginning...you can even use one gear lower than you wud normally use and let them get ahead of you in the first half..dont worry you'll catch them later somewhere near the middle...then slowly shift to the gear you're most comfortable with ( you'll be riding side by side with them by this time)...near the end, tantyahan na yan...if you think you can get to the top at max sustained effort then do it. now if you just want to be a better climber and top your previous record, then i guess you already knew what to do...i think they already said it all above. ..and always remember..according a famous cyclist "it don't get easier, you just get faster". happy climbing Aha! so that's the secret of master tolits...
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PasawayL
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Post by PasawayL on Nov 22, 2007 21:52:07 GMT 8
first of all dont wear a clip less shoes, make it sure na naka running shoes ka...then make buhat your bike and run faster ....hehehe
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Post by hyperion on Nov 22, 2007 22:07:50 GMT 8
ah, i was talking about the baler route we did previously, but my latest experience humbled me much much more than that mountain. I'm talking about mt. sto tomas in baguio. It's only 8 km and it doesn't look too dounting at first. But the combination of unfamiliar terrain and thin (thinner than in my place) air did me in. I was catching my breath all the way up. At first, I was able to sustain a decent pace... as I reach the half way mark, kaboom... I just flipped. From there on, it was like an interval session. Hataw for half a minute, then rest. tsk tsk tsk It took too much time to recover my breath, longer than the usual. Later, I tried to maintain a slow pace, but nonetheless, I was still panting like crazy. No other choice but to hammer and rest. It was like that until I reached the top. I will comeback to that mountain! Promise! I think you are doing fine. Maybe you are expecting too much from yourself especially because you are doing very difficult climbs way too soon. I took on Sierra Madre about 2 months after I started mountainbiking and boy was I given shock treatment - I barely made it past halfway and had to quit. That was because I was also hammering the climbs and soon - I bonked out from muscle fatigue and exhaustion. Alas, leg power and endurance doesn't develop overnight unless you were previously into sports that have already developed your leg's lactate threshold and your lungs' aerobic efficiency (VO2 max). Hataw-stop-hataw is not the most efficient way to attack a long climb - no wonder you are getting short of breath and had to stop a lot of times. You are most likely climbing unaerobically using fast twitch muscles at very high cadence (maybe 100+ rpm if you are using a low gear), which generates lots of lactic acid because of oxygen deficit causing you to become out of breath and to feel more leg burn. This technique also uses up your glycogen stores instead of fat. It does increase your LT or lactate threshold and pain tolerance if done a lot of times. You maybe better off climbing up slowly, at a controlled cadence, using slow twitch muscles in a totally relaxed manner. It may not look impressive to climb slowly using a very low gear but to be able to climb 15 kilometers without dismounting is a bigger achievement that sprinting then stopping (which can be done by just about anybody!); is a very effective fat burner and is a big confidence booster. Once you have reached the top without stopping - then that is only the time you can incrementally incease your pace and intensity until your legs become strong enough to withstand a hammerfest to the top.
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Post by ianic84 on Nov 23, 2007 9:21:05 GMT 8
what about muscle endurance? Long , low intensity rides build endurance I strongly agree!!!
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Post by angelobryant on Nov 23, 2007 9:57:05 GMT 8
thanks guys. Now I know the mistakes I've made. I want to be a great climber and I think this is the area I would like to improve on for the next couple of months. That and endurance. What training regimen do you guys suggest?
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Post by ianic84 on Nov 23, 2007 10:28:22 GMT 8
my mistake on the past is that during training,i try to ride hard...but i realized,it would not do me any good..it will only cause exhaustion... long,slow rides is the best way...you can work on your pedalling motion,practice technical riding & work on comfortable riding position for uphill climbs & steep descents,more miles to cover with minimal exhaustion. ;D ;D
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Post by allegra on Nov 23, 2007 11:00:09 GMT 8
my mistake on the past is that during training,i try to ride hard...but i realized,it would not do me any good..it will only cause exhaustion... long,slow rides is the best way...you can work on your pedalling motion,practice technical riding & work on comfortable riding position for uphill climbs & steep descents,more miles to cover with minimal exhaustion. ;D ;D Yes sir Last year , I would train ( pag nasa mood )hard , then harder everyday. Hills, mountains , on flats parati push ng push All I got from it were flu , cough and migraines Then I'd stop This year , I barely broke sweat worked on my form , built up my aerobic conditioning and just trained 4x a week better's mga times ko sa tris ( way better ) than last year Who would have thought ?
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Post by grnhrnt on Nov 23, 2007 11:52:24 GMT 8
And there's the power to weight ratio. Since your new in biking the power will eventually come or might be developed from other activities which you have done prior to biking. You can improve your climbing abilities if you lose weight. Losing weight on the bike can be expensive though so the less expensive route should be losing weight on your body. Yup aside from all the biking your doing there should be a conscious effort to avoid eating most kinds of visible fat (unsaturated is the worst) and sugars. Cut the softdrinks and powdered juices, lessen the processed foods. If you have to eat rice or use sugar, try brown rice, wheat bread instead of white bread, splenda or brown sugar. All things the same (leg power that is) 5 lbs off will greatly improve you climbing abilities! Good luck
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Post by mountguitars on Nov 23, 2007 12:04:03 GMT 8
angelo, go riding with strong riders. that helped for me. it serves as a gauge. and i thank paul, sir tolits, brusko and everybody i've been with for riding with me during those long, steep climbs. and oh yes, pain is good. if you dont feel it and if you dont know how to deal with it, dehins sya kakarga meaning you wont be strong the next time you ride. that's why cycling is nakaka addict, hehehe ;D come downhill though, i feel alone, hehehe, hahahaha ;D (wag lang road ha )
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Post by angelobryant on Nov 23, 2007 12:20:31 GMT 8
grnhrnt - yes, power to weight ratio. I've lost 6 or 7 kgs na and still planning to loose some. target is 72, i'm currently 77 or so. mountguitars - brad, strong riders here consist of road going racers... mtbikers here are a rare breed but thanks to our group, racers are turning in their skinny machines and slowly migrating to mtb. the biggest hurdle for them is putting on knobby tires, they are not used to it and often complain about the weight but once they've tried the trails... tadaaaa... they complain even more!!!
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lloyd
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Post by lloyd on Nov 23, 2007 12:31:34 GMT 8
Don't forget to take vitamins (specially Vit C an others...) to boost your immune system during hard training...
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jtoms
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Post by jtoms on Nov 23, 2007 12:50:28 GMT 8
just wana share my experience sir. i stop biking for over 4yrs since my bisyo was diverted into cars.. i went back just September 07lang talaga. im 200lbs already. at first, i even experience that "first time on saddle pain sensation" pretty ouch. uphill is really hell for me.
yes, its true, practice pratice and practice lang talaga.
i started to use my bike going o my office as long it has no rain in the morning. i dont care weather it rains in the afternoon.. as much as possible i'll start pedaling at early 6am with my officewares on my messenger bag (cant use backpack, i have left shoulder injury) just to hit a 1 hr trail den go to my office directly.
since then, my weight now is 180lbs (3mons) "biggest looser" hehehe...
i notice, - i gain muscle on my calves and tigh, - my beather is doing a good (those cathing breath a lot), - my butt doesnt hurt anymor, - i have a somehow good cadence.
for gradual long uphill, i just try to keep myself relax. i shift gears just enough for my pedaling. not that i feel pain and heavy and not that too granny (can loose strength also).
if there's a change in degrees, i try to practice pedaling while standing and add little resistance on my shifting. then sit back again to recover. hand position on the HBar sometimes can help you relax and recover. try to lean on ur hand on the grip and position the thumb area up. this will signals ur cardio to open(it works on me)..
hope this can help... it might not be the best tactics but helps me in just 3 months. rule of he tumb, dont burn urself too much. if you feel like stopping, just stop but not for long.
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