oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 27, 2007 1:06:28 GMT 8
can the american indians kick the whites and blacks out of north america? the portugese and spanish from south america? how bout the aborigines in australia? do the negritos have the right to remove you (yes, you the ruling malays) from the face of pinas? people, there was a time in history that nations are only its people, there were no land bounderies to speak of...people conquer people..you defeat them, you have the right on their resources..when foreign policy was the edge of the sword...right was paid with blood that the loser had to honor. just my 2 cents. I see your point sir. But, if the UN sanctions you to remove your military forces, then that sword edge foreign policy would have to sway away in favor of the greater common good as the original charter founded upon by the UN. I would hate to lose Sabah and the Spratleys due to the sword edge policy. This is modern history already - there are no more conquests of nations. Kuwait was defeated by Iraq but the US returned Kuwait to its people. There's also Afghanistan, Bosnia, Croatia... That's just my opinion though
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Post by Ben Dover on Sept 27, 2007 1:26:08 GMT 8
can the american indians kick the whites and blacks out of north america? the portugese and spanish from south america? how bout the aborigines in australia? do the negritos have the right to remove you (yes, you the ruling malays) from the face of pinas? people, there was a time in history that nations are only its people, there were no land bounderies to speak of...people conquer people..you defeat them, you have the right on their resources..when foreign policy was the edge of the sword...right was paid with blood that the loser had to honor. just my 2 cents. I see your point. But, if the UN sanctions you to remove your military forces, then that sword edge foreign policy would have to sway away in favor of the greater common good as the original charter founded upon by the UN. I would hate to lose Sabah and the Spratleys due to the sword edge policy. This is modern history already - there are no more conquests of nations. Kuwait was defeated by Iraq but the US returned Kuwait to its people. There's also Afghanistan, Bosnia, Croatia... That's just my opinion though i agree with you...it not a simple thing right?..this is when the leaders of the nations involved should use their heads in the interest of their own country...saddam destroyed his own country when he became ambitious with kuwait...russia killed his men when it sent them to afghanistan etc etc. if you are the current leader of israel..are you going to cede the occupied territories knowing of their strategic values...that they can be used for launching attacks on your people...that from there pete can hit you with his airsoft rifle anywhere you are in israel? ;D
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oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 27, 2007 1:39:46 GMT 8
Hahaha I dont know jaguar paw, son of flint sky:) Hard to say. We dont belong to any of those countries:) At this point, everyone is the aggressor as everyone is avenging the death or attack on a family member, friend, neighbor, villager, etc. For peace, i think the UN should consult the arabs and the Israelis, mediate and find a common agreeable ground without the intervention of the US. No one is going to back off at this point sir. This is not a cold war. There is a real war going on there (not the same scale as Iraq) that the jewish controlled american media refuses to acknowledge:)
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Post by Ben Dover on Sept 27, 2007 1:53:10 GMT 8
lets agree on that.... a little too complicated for us mountainbikers our only interest on this issue is the fact that, like they say "when america sneezes, the world catches cold"...baka lalong magmahal ang pyesa. ;D my last take on this matter.
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Post by jr on Sept 27, 2007 1:57:47 GMT 8
For me I dont believe on UN. They just face but could do nothing. Also a part of corruption during Saddam era. In regards to the food for oil program.
The Jewish controlled the media..hmmmm but how? Remember US is a free country plus American people had to many resources were they get the information. Not like other countries the supressed the media.
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Post by jr on Sept 27, 2007 1:59:06 GMT 8
lets agree on that.... a little too complicated for us mountainbikers our only interest on this issue is the fact that, like they say "when america sneezes, the world catches cold"...baka lalong magmahal ang pyesa. ;D my last take on this matter. hahahahaha you got that right.
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oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 27, 2007 10:02:57 GMT 8
The Jewish controlled the media..hmmmm but how? Remember US is a free country plus American people had to many resources were they get the information. Not like other countries the supressed the media. Media is not suppressed. Information is just controlled by jews sir. www.compuserb.com/mediain1.htm
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Post by enzo on Sept 27, 2007 13:30:42 GMT 8
It's a plain and simple occupation. The ship carrying them for days on end doesnt have anywhere to go till the british decided to put them in Palestine coz nobody can complain or resist. Like what Oceanrider said, this is the modern history already, there are no more conquest of nation.
I just want to say what I hear personally from people(ladies, children) from the occupied territories. They have forgotten that they are human beings.
My question still remains, What are we going do if we are in their situation?
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Post by jr on Sept 27, 2007 21:44:47 GMT 8
The Jewish controlled the media..hmmmm but how? Remember US is a free country plus American people had to many resources were they get the information. Not like other countries the supressed the media. Media is not suppressed. Information is just controlled by jews sir. www.compuserb.com/mediain1.htmI dont believe that..this article is for anti Israel. What happen for the 1st Amendment plus you can have international channels like aljazeera and rest of anti US channels you get from satellites and ethernet. You should see the media in US. How they attack there own people and govt. You do that in other countries and you will be in prison or die.
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Post by jr on Sept 27, 2007 21:55:42 GMT 8
My question still remains, What are we going do if we are in their situation? For a good reason why not. Just like the current situation in Pinas. Do we wish to be change the entire govt? So the poor people can finally breath? ;D ;D but only a dream . Also the woman in Islamic countries do they forgotten should be same human beings or rights as men? The kids are being used to strap bomb. Why not the leader do that instead of the innocent kid? Lakay -forget about it and just ride .
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badburn
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Post by badburn on Sept 27, 2007 22:31:18 GMT 8
even without dealing with the question of religion..this is a very difficult question to answer...that particular area in the m.east has a story prolly longer than the written history...of wars, government, occupation etc...tracing back in history what people have the rightful claim to it would be next to impossible...according to some books the palestinian people originated from greece...before the palestines came, who were the people there? and whoever those people, just because they were there first, can claim that this land is theirs? shall we just forget and ignore what is happening right now, the recent history and the people who are there right now? how far do we have to go back to determine rightful claim. shall we establish a cutoff period? do the american indians have the right to kick the whites and blacks out of north america? the portugese and spanish from south america? how bout the aborigines in australia? do the negritos have the right to remove you (yes, you the ruling malays) from the face of pinas? people, there was a time in history that nations were only its people, there were no land bounderies to speak of...people conquer people..you defeat them, you have the right on their resources..when foreign policy was the edge of the sword...right was paid with blood that the loser had to honor. just my 2 cents. very well said! interesting views we have in here keep it flowing....
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badburn
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Post by badburn on Sept 27, 2007 22:46:25 GMT 8
My question still remains, What are we going do if we are in their situation? simple question with not so simple answer... whatever you decide choose the lesser evil... choosing and justifying which is the lesser evil is another dilemma!
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oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 27, 2007 23:00:35 GMT 8
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oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 27, 2007 23:16:08 GMT 8
Also the woman in Islamic countries do they forgotten should be same human beings or rights as men? The kids are being used to strap bomb. Why not the leader do that instead of the innocent kid? I agree with you sir. We have to understand though that women have different roles in arab countries. That is part of their culture. That is what makes them, them. I dont think their culture will change or evolve soon as it is based on fundamental principles of their religion. I think it is wrong to try to enforce a change on others' culture. I also dont like the idea of child bombers. I think that's wrong. I think many of us will be surprised that these children dream of doing this someday as this is part of their religious beliefs just like all the saints who died in christ's name. www.betar.co.uk/articles/betar1059578683.phpall religions have their own form of indoctrination - i think this is really a radical way to express one's faith. I dont think the leaders force these kids to do this. I dont think the leaders even try to stop these kids. I think it is really more a personal interpretation of faith. I remember in elementary though that our teachers spoke about the great sacrifice of the first martyr, Stephen, and how we should all be like him .... I also wanted to be a martyr like Lorenzo Ruiz when i was young. Just like arab indoctrination i guess but taken in our context - this i blame on the lack of educational support given to arabs to help their people open their minds
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Post by jr on Sept 28, 2007 0:02:54 GMT 8
How about Passion of the Christ (Hit movie by Mel Gibson, Partial movie of Borat ;D? Anyways everyone have different opinion. That the good thing this site we argued our differences but we still respect each other . Lets ride.
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oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 28, 2007 22:01:23 GMT 8
The passion of christ is an accepted and celebrated tragedy and tradition that the whole world is aware of already sir. No sense in trying to cover it up. Everyone knows about it. On the jew issue in Borat - its really humor. If anything, it must have attracted more sympathy for them as the character he portrays is not a very likeable one - but funny. Sacha Baron Cohen is an english jew by the way. The movies i meant were about the plight of palestinians from jewish atrocities - like a palestinian version of black hawk down, platoon, band of brothers etc. The movies you mentioned do not even mention anything about palestine which was my point. There is no attack on the jewish nation as a whole
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Post by allegra on Sept 28, 2007 22:11:32 GMT 8
Hard to watch a palestinian lovestory kasi whenever I think about them , it's massacre at munich or hijacked passenger jets that comes to mind Interesting times there now w/ the ruling party cooperating w/ Israel in the west bank , while the Hamas are trapped in Gaza
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Post by jr on Sept 28, 2007 22:33:22 GMT 8
The passion of christ is an accepted and celebrated tragedy and tradition that the whole world is aware of already sir. No sense in trying to cover it up. Everyone knows about it. On the jew issue in Borat - its really humor. If anything, it must have attracted more sympathy for them as the character he portrays is not a very likeable one - but funny. Sacha Baron Cohen is an english jew by the way. The movies i meant were about the plight of palestinians from jewish atrocities - like a palestinian version of black hawk down, platoon, band of brothers etc. The movies you mentioned do not even mention anything about palestine which was my point. There is no attack on the jewish nation as a whole The thing is no one interested on movies would make profits. Specially from countries who supported terrorism. BBC one time showed TV program in the Palestinian state. Most of the program was about West are bad. They cant even watch kids shows because they are banned. One time the kids watching Jihad movies and how to commit suicide and become a hero. The parents applauding them. For me that is sickinning. As a parent should think the future of there kids.
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Post by dayuhan on Sept 29, 2007 11:09:50 GMT 8
My plan for peace in Palestine...
Build a big factory on the West Bank. In this factory you assemble widgets. You ship the widgets to another big factory in Gaza, where you disassemble the widgets and ship the components back to the first factory. Keep the circle going. Put every Palestinian male between 18 and 50 on the payroll, punching a clock and getting a check every 15th and 30th.
How many suicide bombers do you think you'd see?
Sure, it would cost... but it would have to be cheaper than a constant war. How many billions in "aid" and weapons get shipped into that area every year?
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Post by enzo on Sept 29, 2007 13:27:12 GMT 8
Dayuhan, Well said, support the people, give them livelihood. That way they will live properly and wont complain about the occupation. Lakay, They dont have anything today, They will be no future. Tha's how desperate they are. You're right! Let's just ride. But I used to be like you siding or depending America and all it's policy in the Middle East. The rest I dont care coz I no nothing about. But Now that Im here and seeing the big picture, I've change of heart. Palestinians are human beings too and just like us, they want to survive. Everywhere in the world people are the same and that its to live and it's children to grow up and have at least the basic necessities if not luxuries. About the Muslim women thing, In the Taliban regime Id prolly say you're right, but in Palestine and Lebanon, Nah! They dont have the same freedom as the western world but they want it and it's they culture. Some are actually applicable to our very open culture. Im speaking of this coz I have so many friends from this countries. Maybe I give a d@mn now that I have friends from this countries And Im starting to fall in love with them. You know, knight in shining armor, damsel in distress ;D But still, Palestine is dead and it's people are dying, The Govt is in total war with itself and I pity the people. Mahmoud Abass is doing great by accepting the fact that they cannot survive if they will continue fighting the Israelis and lose the Foreign aid. Hamas on the other hand was a populist resistance movement who pockets the money and mess up all peace talks to surive or remain in existance and push their weight around. I like it when they were a resistance movement then. And let's not forget about Iran capitalizing on the situation. Anyway! My last take on this and I just hope they find a solution so I can visit the Holy land and Palestine someday. Let's ride na lang! Hehehe!
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Post by enzo on Sept 29, 2007 18:20:24 GMT 8
My question still remains, What are we going do if we are in their situation? simple question with not so simple answer... whatever you decide choose the lesser evil... choosing and justifying which is the lesser evil is another dilemma! Try to put yourself in their situation first, then you tell me which is evil, be it lesser or greater. Let's just hope we dont get into this kind of situation. Peace to all peace loving people.
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badburn
Newbie
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Post by badburn on Sept 30, 2007 9:53:36 GMT 8
violence begets violence... mtbiking begets mtbiking... now we have an easy choice ;D
I have lost a friend in Iraq, my sister's best friend in Israel no the thanks to the bombs designed to kill the guilty(?) yet taking innocent lives as well... talk about a family losing their sole bread winner...
I have seen more than enough violence on TV, on paper... yet I for one is still a firm believer of a non-violent solution... We may not know exactly how to do it now or there is no such solution at the moment... It is good to note that at least someone is still hoping for a non-violent solution... it may not happen on my lifetime... my key word is still hope.
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Post by weekendrider on Sept 30, 2007 10:29:24 GMT 8
With regard to the problem with Israel and Palestinian. What can we do as PinoyMTbikers to change the situation.? What can we do to alleviate the suffering of so many people on that part of the world? What can we do as a mountain biker, for America not to support Taiwan. Would it be better for us to start looking from within? What can we do about those poor soul we pass by on the street and on the trail during our rides? How can we make their life a little better? How can we as mountain bikers be able to tell the Church to stop mingling with government affairs regarding population control which is needed badly in our country. What can we do us mountain bikers to stop politician from enriching themselves while in office? Just a question.
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schwinng
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Save the planet, ride a bicycle!
Posts: 293
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Post by schwinng on Sept 30, 2007 13:41:07 GMT 8
I've been in this country (USA) since I was 12 years old. As a little kid I used to see America as an omnipotent place with perfect leaders, perfect everything. As I grew older and wiser, as I read and gone through books and different levels of education I started to see the real, clearer picture. I love this country but I don't agree with some, if not most of its foreign policy, especially the current administration's. We're entitled to our own personal opinions. I just don't get why some people still cling to the idea of "Manifest Destiny", a truly Anglo point of view. I guess we could see parallels to this in the Middle East with former British colonies and other European former colonies in disarray both politically and economically. The Palestinians are being forced out or in in their own land. Some people see them as terrorists, but I say they are freedom fighters. They are merely fighting to have 3 square meals a day and fighting for what truly is theirs--the Jewish occupied Palestinian lands.
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Post by enzo on Sept 30, 2007 13:48:50 GMT 8
With regard to the problem with Israel and Palestinian. What can we do as PinoyMTbikers to change the situation.? What can we do to alleviate the suffering of so many people on that part of the world? What can we do as a mountain biker, for America not to support Taiwan. Would it be better for us to start looking from within? What can we do about those poor soul we pass by on the street and on the trail during our rides? How can we make their life a little better? How can we as mountain bikers be able to tell the Church to stop mingling with government affairs regarding population control which is needed badly in our country. What can we do us mountain bikers to stop politician from enriching themselves while in office? Just a question. Weekender, Good question,,,, On our part here, we started our group from the old, inactive Pinoy group and grew to an international one. Attracting people who came from that troubled spot. Just like you and me, they are normal people who wants to have a chance at life, a peaceful and free one. At first they are wary when I open up something about the situation in their country. Thinking it's just another line to get them engaged in an argument or a prelude to a pick up. They hold meetings and get togethers, finds way to be united away from their homeland, and continue supporting their people back home. They never ever talk about the situation or doesnt want to talk about it cos for them it's a hopeless case already. My friend said her Mom stop laughing for a long time and pevented her from watching the news coz she always goes into depression. So many stories which they dont want to share for the fact that the whole world has forgotten about them. Thats where we came in and gave them a different perspective in life. Cycling!!! We have about 6 cyclist from that country and 4 are girls. Everybody knows what cycling can do to our mind and body so I dont have to explain it. Every now and then, they bring friends and join us and was amazed how similar our culture to their's. Like close knit community, deep love for country, family and God , we never ever argue about religion and they have as much respect as we have to them. From our side on the Pinoy scene, Joining the group or cycling is the first step, keeps us healthy and away from drugs, booze, even cigarettes. Then raising awareness among our network, spreading it. Easing them on their transition stage in Dubai. The more jobs we get for our countrymen, the more money we can send back home. after all, we are the modern heroes ekanga. Badburn, I for one cannot go for a violent reaction and I appreciate your peace loving nature. Now,why do you think they do this suicide bombing? Lets forget about the paid ones, paid or not, I cannot think of anything why they do this. Have you seen a depressed area (squatters) demolition? I was just asking myself about the violence I see in these demolitions and compared it to the situation In Palestine. They are as human beings as we are. My final, final take on this. Thanks to everyone who shared their thoughts. Lets Ride! Coz Im riding with my Palestinian friend even if she's fasting!!!!
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oceanrider88
Free Rider
Life is like riding a wave. To keep your balance you must keep moving.
Posts: 299
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Post by oceanrider88 on Sept 30, 2007 19:27:17 GMT 8
With regard to the problem with Israel and Palestinian. What can we do as PinoyMTbikers to change the situation.? What can we do to alleviate the suffering of so many people on that part of the world? What can we do as a mountain biker, for America not to support Taiwan. Would it be better for us to start looking from within? What can we do about those poor soul we pass by on the street and on the trail during our rides? How can we make their life a little better? How can we as mountain bikers be able to tell the Church to stop mingling with government affairs regarding population control which is needed badly in our country. What can we do us mountain bikers to stop politician from enriching themselves while in office? Just a question. We can open our minds and be aware of the things going around us so that every time a topic like this comes up, you can share an objective insight based on historical facts. Ideas shape the world. You dont have to make a flag to wave in front of the US embassy. You dont even have to lobby anything. You just have to keep an open mind and politely inform people your points of view every time something a topic like this comes up. I will try my best to tell my children the truth about anything that they would like to know. Because what they know, may help shape our future.
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sdny
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Har-Har-Har "Terrible-Terrible-Terrible"
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Post by sdny on Oct 25, 2007 23:30:36 GMT 8
on my opinion: china has no chance of invading taiwan, why because taiwan is a great value to them as well as hong kong and macao they axis this province to gain higher percentage of their economy. and also china has no massive air force and naval support for invasion as what "jane military strategist", comments on there military fire power....china is one of the largest military, infantry consist of 1m+ but take note for the past decade their military fire power is not yet proven, they relay on the russian supplies but not in the war experince, the only tested their military infantry is during the students uprising in beijing which they crush the non combatant, countrymen...and beside it during the tropical storm, there military personel is the first line of defense! for the u.s. as we read on the news/cnn, the only way to destroy china is their economy, majority of the international industrial site was base in china, because of cheap labor. imagine hundred of thousands even millions of product were recalled by the u.s. for some chemicals ingredient that harmful to human. crush there economy, it's losing a war on the battleground....
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Post by allegra on Oct 26, 2007 8:32:03 GMT 8
Galing ng mga threADS dito sa News and Current Affairs All of them are intelligent discussions Di tuloy ako makapasok sa usapan haha
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Post by jr on Oct 26, 2007 9:23:56 GMT 8
Galing ng mga threADS dito sa News and Current Affairs All of them are intelligent discussions Di tuloy ako makapasok sa usapan haha Allegra..thats a good thing. everyone share there point of you and with open minded. Actually is a family discussion. I hope when I visit someday and ride with PinoyMTBiker no one will get revenge at me by eat there dust ;D. All members here I treat them as a part of family.
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Post by Ben Dover on Oct 26, 2007 10:51:39 GMT 8
i believe china is sacrificing a lot of things just for the sake of economic progress...i guess that's what the other nations are trying to tell them including the US...they should follow and comply with international standards. i've been watching videos from discovery...beijing i believe is one of the most polluted cities in the world...western scientists pa are the ones spearheading the study and preservation of their environment which i believe they are capable of doing by themselves...ex: yangtse, yellow and mekong rivers and the giant fishes that live there. you can call me naive, but i dont think the western nations are doing that to sabotage their economy...i believe nothing is more dangerous than a man with a gun and an empty stomach...western leaders certainly know that too. just mt 2 cents
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