|
Post by anshwa on Jun 15, 2006 21:45:18 GMT 8
jaymz, is your avatar a shot from sanctuary?
|
|
|
Post by kulot_salot on Jun 16, 2006 8:20:54 GMT 8
nope brad, this shot is taken from the rook area last may, when i gave rock climbing 101 for PNBMC... its exactly in-between the chimney and screwdriver route... it's a beginner route... i showed the PNBMC group the route after i have setup the top-rope... ...i posted a text under it "not using my head" cuz my head is missing from the shot... ;D i'm looking for a foothold... i was changing my foot placement... anshwa: i just changed my avatar brad, just now... an older photo
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 16, 2006 21:58:55 GMT 8
ah, ok... now I see it. Yeah, right beside the chimney. I didn't see it in the avatar. Nice! You look familiar, man.
|
|
|
Post by kulot_salot on Jun 17, 2006 8:04:59 GMT 8
m 1 of the hermit of aling norma's store in WRG every weekend before that d@mn P500 fee per activity municipal ordinance! you sir? bka we know each other...
|
|
|
Post by >rocketman> on Jun 20, 2006 9:14:47 GMT 8
saw in the news, that dale's summit was acknowledge/confimed by elizabeth hawley, himalayan archive, any comments?
|
|
|
Post by kulot_salot on Jun 20, 2006 16:34:18 GMT 8
there's a gossip circulating within the local mountaineering community that the interview with ms. elizabeth hawley by ms. korina sanchez of abs-cbn has been misquoted... will do an update...
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 20, 2006 21:39:12 GMT 8
m 1 of the hermit of aling norma's store in WRG every weekend before that d@mn P500 fee per activity municipal ordinance! you sir? bka we know each other... Ah, kaya siguro. I'm Ferdie Araga. I've had a fair amount of time in Montalban. I pretty much climbed w/ the Power Up crew before I left for the US. Great times!
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 20, 2006 21:52:39 GMT 8
You know the funny thing about this matter of Dale Abenojar reaching the summit is that even in mounteverest.net, they don't have an actual confirmation of his summit. They have a listing of summiteers from the south side & north side. They listed our three mountaineering heroes in the south side but they don't have a list of a Filipino in the north side. And I'm still looking for it again but I've read an article about the high number of summit disputes on the north side & practically none on the south side. They (the site) presented that there were climbers who claim they summitted when in fact they only reached the Summit Ridge. Is it only me or does the summit photo submitted by Abenojar looked more like a ridge than a peak? I'll look for the article again.
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 20, 2006 21:58:54 GMT 8
Looking for the article I mentioned above, I found this one from 2005. Note that Ms. Hawley is included in this article.
Official Mount Everest Summits taken from EverestNews.com
What is an official Everest Summit? The Truth? There is no "official Everest Summit" list! There has never been one and there probably never will be. With all the misinformation being spread around on the internet and other media sources this year, we thought we should do a brief over view of this subject. Again, this is a brief overview.
Yes, Elizabeth Hawley, fondly referred to as the queen bee of mountain records, has her lists. While Eliz has done a remarkable, job over the years. Eliz has clearly been wrong in some cases in her records in our opinion over the years. (sorry Liz!).
In Nepal, the Ministry of Tourism has a list of Everest Summiters on Everest from the Nepal side with some years the Chinese side added, but other years, they do not include the Chinese side at all. While one could argue that is an "official list for the Nepal side"; they have several errors in their list... How do you get on this list? Let's talk today's world, not the world of 10 years ago. Today the Liaison Officer either calls or helps to send an e-mail to the Ministry of Tourism. Now sometimes, names are forgotten, or every once in awhile a name included by mistake. Overall, there list is probably 95% or more "right" for Everest Nepal side of the mountain. Not bad!
An example e-mail from this year:
Everest Base Camp Thursday, 2 June 2005
His Majesty's Government
Ministry Of Culture, Tourism & Civil Aviation
Tourism Industry Division
Mountaineering Section
Brikuti Mandap
Kathmandu, Nepal
Please to be informed that the following team members of 2005 XXXXXXXXXXXXXX has successfully reached the summit of Mr. Everest on 02 June 2005 at XXXXXX am Nepal standard time.
1. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
2. XXXXXXXXX Sherpa (Khumjung 8, Pangboche, Solukhumbu)
XXXXXXXXX
Liaison Officer
XXXXXX Sherpa
Expedition Sardar/BC Manager
When sending these e-mails, does the Liaison Officer and the Expedition Sardar/BC Manager know for sure these people have summited? "Personal knowledge", probably not. Some summits are never called or e-mailed in, therefore they never show up on the Ministry of Tourism list. The Ministry of Tourism list is right 98% or more of the time in recent year. The system actually works very well in Nepal.
Spelling? Let's not go there...
Other Lists: EverestNews.com has a list. Our list like Eliz's needs to be kept in pencil, which we will explain later. Messner, has always said that he keeps a list which he published in one of his books a few years ago, not sure if he still does today... Others keep lists, and some people seem to claim Elizabeth Hawley's list as theirs...
Now. Let's look at the Chinese side, sometimes referred to as the Wild Wild West these days...
Some on the North side (Chinese side) pick up a "Summit Certificate" from the TMA official. Does this person(s) know for sure, "have personal" knowledge of these summits? Of course not. Sometimes they have been known to ask the 20 questions... At least one trekking agent in Nepal has a book of these "Summit Certificates" in the office in Kathmandu. A few "Summit Certificates" have been issued for people who did not summit Everest. Neither the TMA nor the CMA keep any official lists at all.
SO? Does what does all of this mean?? The "standard", in general for a "summit" is a person's word. In Elizabeth Hawley's case, she asks the expedition leader to fill out a form, listing the summits. Liz also assumes, as we understand it, that the climbers are telling the truth, unless contrary information surfaces which causes her to further investigate. Liz's system is heavy based on what the expedition leader tells her. EverestNews.com does something similar, however, we try to get pictures if there is a dispute and we have many sources, rather than just the expedition leader. EverestNews.com, makes a "call" in most cases. In 99% of the cases, we go with the climbers word. In some cases, we have chosen not to list climbers, who we believe based on evidence from others or from themselves, that they did not summit. If there is no evidence against a Summit, then the climber's word is taken. Climbers are listed on our list and Ms Hawley's list who we believe have not summited Everest, however, without evidence against them the standard of the climber's word wins out.
Climbers who dispute summits, while in base camp, while the summit was taking place at the summit are not given much weight by EverestNews.com. Basically EverestNews.com uses the the same process when deaths occur; for example when Nils Antezana died last year, many offered opinions from base camp, these in many cases might be "experts opinions", they were not on the summit with Nil, and thereofre did not *know* what happened, they simply offered an opinion. Therefore we try to go to those who were on the summit and get as much information as possible. It is a long unrewarding task and many times you never know for sure.
This year we have recorded 2 disputes of Everest summits from the North so far! We would not be surprised if there is more to follow. When can a decision be expected? In several months... Maybe!
|
|
|
Post by kulot_salot on Jun 21, 2006 8:43:12 GMT 8
m 1 of the hermit of aling norma's store in WRG every weekend before that d@mn P500 fee per activity municipal ordinance! you sir? bka we know each other... Ah, kaya siguro. I'm Ferdie Araga. I've had a fair amount of time in Montalban. I pretty much climbed w/ the Power Up crew before I left for the US. Great times! ah Ferdie! nice to know that we both went mountain biking now brad! usually i'm w/ my climbing buddy, boying, when i go there @ WRG. boying is now in canada... kakulitan kami ni julius, jong & sixto... ;D lately, i hooked-up with joseph, aldwin & rigor of redpoint... ;D joseph & rigor is now into mountain biking also... ;D cheers to you brad! ;D ;D ;D
|
|
|
Post by kulot_salot on Jun 21, 2006 8:58:44 GMT 8
stilll no official everest list from himalayan database. even Hawley has been wrong in the past. If ever she's wrong on Dale, this is not the first time...
and this is more interesting: <snip> Some on the North side (Chinese side) pick up a "Summit Certificate" from the TMA official. Does this person(s) know for sure, "have personal" knowledge of these summits? Of course not. Sometimes they have been known to ask the 20 questions... At least one trekking agent in Nepal has a book of these "Summit Certificates" in the office in Kathmandu. A few "Summit Certificates" have been issued for people [glow=red,2,300]who did not summit Everest[/glow]. Neither the TMA nor the CMA keep any official lists at all.<snip>
|
|
|
Post by Blister T on Jun 21, 2006 10:04:21 GMT 8
I saw in the news that dale abenojar's sherpa lost all 10 toes. kawawa naman. cant the sherpa's themselves vouch if their "alaga" has reached the summit or not? if there's one person who knows if dale has reached the peak it must be his sherpa right?
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 21, 2006 11:16:32 GMT 8
ah Ferdie! nice to know that we both went mountain biking now brad! usually i'm w/ my climbing buddy, boying, when i go there @ WRG. boying is now in canada... kakulitan kami ni julius, jong & sixto... ;D lately, i hooked-up with joseph, aldwin & rigor of redpoint... ;D joseph & rigor is now into mountain biking also... ;D cheers to you brad! ;D ;D ;D Ah, okey! Nice! Musta na? Actually I've been mountainbiking when I was there. It was sort of part of my cross training & off-season stuff. Used to do trails w/ Idol, Jong(nag-bike nga ba si Jong nun?), Chonie, Ruben,... practically everyone who had a bike sa gym. Then about a couple of years before I left for the US, I got into DH/FR when I met Ricky's crew during our gigs at the Marlboro Adventure Team in the malls. I'm still climbing here - although pretty much bouldering na lang. Hehe, musta mo ko kay Aldwin! Good to see you here, man. Keep us posted here about Dale's summit proof. To be honest, I feel bad for him but hey, if your reputation precedes you, you have to be ready to prove something this huge to those who are quite in the know (so to speak).
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 21, 2006 21:34:03 GMT 8
I saw in the news that dale abenojar's sherpa lost all 10 toes. kawawa naman. cant the sherpa's themselves vouch if their "alaga" has reached the summit or not? if there's one person who knows if dale has reached the peak it must be his sherpa right? I don't know if I read it wrong but wasn't there an article in a Philippine newspaper where they said his teammates ( ) vouched for his summit? Di ko sure kung sherpa nya.
|
|
|
Post by kulot_salot on Jun 24, 2006 8:23:00 GMT 8
|
|
|
Post by anshwa on Jun 26, 2006 22:28:05 GMT 8
So what's the development there in the Philippines regarding this matter?
|
|
|
Post by lucban on Jul 12, 2006 10:15:45 GMT 8
Mabuhay!! Kudos to Phil. Everest team especially to my "Paisano" Leo Oracion, he's from my hometown Lucban.I think growing up in lucban helps Leo in having a good tolerance to high altitude place since Lucban is 1500 ft above sea level and its a common practice to most able "lucbanin" to climb Mt. Banahaw once a year.Again, "Mabuhay to Phil. Everest Team!!!"."Baling galing mo talaga Leo!!!"
|
|