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Post by jr on May 23, 2006 1:43:01 GMT 8
Mga kapatid, I was often told by my elders that there are three things people shouldn't talk about: money, politics, and religion. I will bet my life that you've heard of this before and I wonder right now why we can't heed it. Don't get me wrong: I'm not raining on your parade, nor am I trying to arrest freedom of speech in this thread. I just happen to know exactly where this is all going. You know, being a believer is as heavy as being an atheist. We all know that proving the existence of a god can go on and on. And so is proving whether a god is non-existent can be impossible to do as well. I'm not exactly sure why Max started this thread or how he wants it to go. One thing I'm sure of is, his intention was not to separate believers from non-believers. Niether does he want us to debate whether a god exists or not. So guys, girls, kids, lolos, lolas and lolitas, take it easy on the posting. We're all one in this forum. Totally agree with Bruce..whats out your offending someone.
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Post by Ben Dover on May 23, 2006 10:00:47 GMT 8
am not catholic but i believe in God...i was born in a conservative evangelical protestant family but i have my own concept of God based on what so far i've learned and experience not necessarily in the same doctrine as the said church follows...although we dont say it but i believe many us are in a same situation as me...i often hear comments like "am a catholic but i dont believe in the infallability of the pope, in rosary etc...i hear catholic mass with my wife (who is a catholic) with my kids whenever there's a chance...heck i'll even go to a mosque if invited. why i believe in God..coz so far nothing i've heard or learn can convince me otherwise...i dont believe this earth and everything in it came into existence by chance or by some freak accident...you cant get order out of chaos by itself..that is without intervention..left by itself everthing tend to decay...a tree, fruit, civilization, stone, the oceans, culture, language, human race, stars, galaxies, the earth itself...everything...therefore someone or something created them first. what separate us from animals?..we have spoken language, culture etc and guest what...belief in God (although not all hehe!)...we fear and worship God...ba ang daga in the same concept as we have...wala...they fear the cat (so its their god then hehe! ) among all the creatures on this earth we are suppose to be the most intelligent right? yet most of us worship a God that we dont see..could it be that rats after all eh talagang mas tama sa atin?...we are the most intelligent and at the same time the most stupid? animals have survival instincts because threat are real and it is necessary...and we have our concept of God because God is real and it is necessary?
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Post by forcebinder on May 23, 2006 10:34:44 GMT 8
overall...lets all just try to be good...even if you dnt believe in Christ or God there's no worry if you die....hehehe
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Post by Blister T on May 23, 2006 11:28:45 GMT 8
why naman bruce? i like this thread..think i'm learning a lot..kinda mind stimulating...unfortunately mas dumadami tanong ko..hehe! i have the ff questions to those who dont believe in God. 1) if you dont believe in God why it is important for you to do good deeds? 2) what is your definition of good or good deeds. am not gonna tell anyone you are wrong...i respect everyone's opinion...am just curious...i might have some follow up questions though. the problem w some people is that they automatically connect having a religion = good and having no religion (atheism) = bad or not believing in a god make u dont wanna care about doing good... its never like that... brad if u remember ur history right, there are more people killed due to religion than any other physical causes... christian crusades, hitler's holocaust, muslim extremist attacks, etc... so please tell me why an intelligent, thinking being would think that if u dont believe in god you are automatically evil... you cannot define what moral or immoral is to a person... killing can be moral for one religion but not for some... having more than one wife for example is immoral for catholic & christians but for other religions like islam, it isnt immoral. morality, while it can be influenced by religion, must not be connected to it. simply saying, its wrong to connect believing in god as good and not believing as bad. that goes against logic. being an atheist means not believing in a supreme being or a god... that doesnt make us satanic or evil because that doesnt exist for us also. its just plain stupid for me to connect the two. doing good deeds means to live and let live. u dont need a religion to know whats good and bad and u dont need a god to do good... thats just so weak. I, for example have been an atheist for nearly 10 years now, I am sure and proud to say that I am doing and have been doing good. I am not perfect and I obviously make mistakes but I havent killed or hurt anyone and I respect people's beliefs. I never tell a christian or a muslim that they are wrong. And the most important thing is I never influence anyone to believe in what I believe in, which is the opposite of christians. I dont go around knocking on peoples houses to tell them that my religion is better or tell people that if they dont believe in my god that they will be punished and live eternally in a place of suffering. ika nga brad, "Keep thy religion to thyself" -george carlin and the now famous "what matters is what you believe in" -robert langdon
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Post by Ben Dover on May 23, 2006 12:28:42 GMT 8
wow! that's the best explanation of atheism i've read so far...except for the first paragraph that kinda confused me a little...is atheism really the absence of religion? or it's a religion that don't believe in the existence of a supreme being?
blister, dont get me wrong here...these are mere inquiries for my own understanding (of course sa iba rin na interesado)...as i said before i respect everyone's opinion...and i believe that the answer to these questions will help in the better understanding of other people's belief...di ba mas mabuti yun? nagkaka-problema lang pag di nagkakaintindihan..hope other readers understand my position too.
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Post by BrusKO on May 23, 2006 12:42:38 GMT 8
Atheism is the belief that a god is non-existent. In short, dismissal of a god- may it be the Catholic, Muslim or any other god. It's not faith. Others may lie somewhere in between. And the person is called an agnostic: one who cannot dismiss the existence of a god nor can prove one. Agnosticism is the practice of the belief thereof. Semantics my friend. This is where battles are fought for.
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Post by Ben Dover on May 23, 2006 13:38:23 GMT 8
hmm...what do you call a person who don't believe in supreme balbon? that would be me. bwahahahaha! ;D
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Post by BrusKO on May 23, 2006 15:04:55 GMT 8
hmm...what do you call a person who don't believe in supreme balbon? that would be me. bwahahahaha! ;D Kalbo! That's what you call that person!
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Post by Ben Dover on May 23, 2006 15:14:46 GMT 8
hmm...what do you call a person who don't believe in supreme balbon? that would be me. bwahahahaha! ;D Kalbo! That's what you call that person! balbon! sasabunutan kita...may araw ka rin (trans: i'll shave you hahaha! ;D )
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Post by Alphabolt on May 23, 2006 17:46:54 GMT 8
Atheism is the belief that a god is non-existent. In short, dismissal of a god- may it be the Catholic, Muslim or any other god. OR a denial of God ... in the case of ex-believers I wonder what circumstances or realisations lead one to stop having faith As the song goes " You ve lost that loving feelin" I love religion, Im not high on rituals but I love the local bond that it creates: intrafamily & community...and the existential bond: with God I dont fear God ..rather I fear the concept of not having a good guy on the steering wheel ikanga The above are my humble but definite opinions only. We dont have to agree or disagree but we are allowed to speak out...and of course read those sharing bits of others Amen?!
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boyet
Free Rider
Posts: 309
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Post by boyet on May 23, 2006 18:04:29 GMT 8
That's my alphabolt two thumps up. Hey guys how about the da vince code? do you believe it or not and why?
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Post by joes on May 23, 2006 20:20:31 GMT 8
take the blue pill if you're too bothered to find out about the truth. the answers you seek would only lead to more questions.
also, atheists have feelings too.
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Post by jovellcheng on May 23, 2006 20:39:38 GMT 8
[glow=yellow,2,300]The Da Vinci Code is more like a conspiracy theory and a fiction/thriller for entertainment. Makes me wonder why religious sects extremely reacts to it.
Maybe there are some truth to it?
Question:
Di ba catholic is against gays and lesbos? Bakit ang dami?[/glow]
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Post by jovellcheng on May 23, 2006 20:48:38 GMT 8
[glow=yellow,2,300]Is jesus gay? [/glow]
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Post by g.b.b on May 24, 2006 0:15:15 GMT 8
[glow=yellow,2,300]The Da Vinci Code is more like a conspiracy theory and a fiction/thriller for entertainment. Makes me wonder why religious sects extremely reacts to it.
Maybe there are some truth to it?
Question:
Di ba catholic is against gays and lesbos? Bakit ang dami?[/glow] i can say, Xmen is a must see movie. i wasnt entertained with the davinci code, it just made me curious about my belief and also affects my faith with the Supreme Being but nevertheless ang galing ng xmen. patay lahat hehehehe
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Post by anshwa on May 24, 2006 0:55:30 GMT 8
That's my alphabolt two thumps up. Hey guys how about the da vince code? do you believe it or not and why? It's FICTION. Although the idea of Christ having a child with Mary Magdalene was pretty good, everything in the book was made up. Pentagrams, Priory of Scion, Rose line, Holy Grail in the Paintings, Apostle John being a Mary Magdalene, Anagrams, etc., etc. I read the book for entertainment & that's what I got. To look at it other than fiction is foolish... Besides, there were so many other books prior to The Da Vinci Code that proposed the same theories. IMO, Dan Brown's book became a movie, not because it's probably true, but because he wrote it with the energy of a Hollywood film. Much like Gladiator or the Patriot - they looked & sounded real but were just fiction.
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Post by wcoastbo on May 24, 2006 1:14:03 GMT 8
I don't have much to add to the religion/faith/God theme, there were many good opinions already stated here. It's good to air out differences, talk is good for the soul and the mind. I'm glad this did not turn into you're wrong/I'm right thread or you're going to hell/heaven, but instead stayed mature and inoffensive as possible (some people will always be offended, it's the nature the topic. especially when humor is interjected). What I'm trying to say is that there are good people on this forum, from both sides of the fence.
I would like to reiterate that religious=good and non-believer=bad mentality has somehow worked it's way into the fabric of religion. I think this is inaccurate and bad for religion. This "us" vs "them" mentality leads to religious violence or to isolationism and mass suicide like Jonestown.
The discussion has been interesting!
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Post by anshwa on May 24, 2006 2:08:34 GMT 8
Right you are, wcoastbo! It doesn't matter what you believe in as long as you live a life that is good and do nothing to harm yourself or others - well, unless of course you're trying that 360 table over a 20 ft gap... Argh... the dream... the dream...
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Post by forcebinder on May 24, 2006 8:35:44 GMT 8
yup!!! nice one wcoastbo! OT: g.b.b...what happened in xmen 3??? patay lahat???
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Post by Ben Dover on May 24, 2006 9:02:47 GMT 8
the truth is out there...hmm...why the heck it's always out there? yup, 100% agree with bo.
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Post by g.b.b on May 24, 2006 9:17:01 GMT 8
yup!!! nice one wcoastbo! OT: g.b.b...what happened in xmen 3??? patay lahat??? hmmmmmm......... basta madami namatay na mutant.
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Post by Blister T on May 24, 2006 10:04:31 GMT 8
wow! that's the best explanation of atheism i've read so far...except for the first paragraph that kinda confused me a little...is atheism really the absence of religion? or it's a religion that don't believe in the existence of a supreme being? blister, dont get me wrong here...these are mere inquiries for my own understanding (of course sa iba rin na interesado)...as i said before i respect everyone's opinion...and i believe that the answer to these questions will help in the better understanding of other people's belief...di ba mas mabuti yun? nagkaka-problema lang pag di nagkakaintindihan..hope other readers understand my position too. no prob brad... all's cool... sorry kung mejo strong yung words/explanation, ganyan lang talaga ako when raising a point.... the "dugong abugado" is starting to show hehehe atheism for me is both the absence of religion and not believing in a supreme being... kasi if u define religion, it is defined as a belief in something, so i guess calling atheism a religion is 'technically' wrong.
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Post by joes on May 24, 2006 12:48:24 GMT 8
let's hear you people unify your beliefs first before you pointing fingers.
- you say you're catholic, but you have buddahs and shivas around your house.
- you say you're a christian, yet you follow chinese traditions.
- you say you're devout yet you believe in evolution.
- you say all these things yet you do bad things, not in the religious sense, but those oppose to the laws of man.
the reason some people shun away from religion is because they don't want to be hypocrites. they don't want to bound themselves to rules just so they could bend them.
and because christianity believes that people rode dinasaurs like the flintstones did.
and because you don't find anything wrong with premarital sex.
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Post by BrusKO on May 24, 2006 13:02:05 GMT 8
let's hear you people unify your beliefs first before you pointing fingers. - you say you're catholic, but you have buddahs and shivas around your house. - you say you're a christian, yet you follow chinese traditions. - you say you're devout yet you believe in evolution. - you say all these things yet you do bad things, not in the religious sense, but those oppose to the laws of man. the reason some people shun away from religion is because they don't want to be hypocretes. they don't want to bound themselves to rules just so they could bend them. and because christianity believes that people rode dinasaurs like the flintstones did. Uhmmm... Just a question padre: was Fred in the Bible? Hehehe
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Post by joes on May 24, 2006 13:04:10 GMT 8
that's the arguement scholars posted dude. not me. i believe in intelligent design.
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Post by BrusKO on May 24, 2006 13:06:34 GMT 8
Me too.
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Post by joes on May 24, 2006 13:13:38 GMT 8
i dunno dude. i'm just trying to limit my hypocrisy. hehehe.
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Post by Ben Dover on May 24, 2006 13:27:48 GMT 8
[glow=yellow,2,300]Joes, to add to your questions... Why do Believe in God's rules when you also think it's cool to see girls on skimpy clothes washing your car? AAAAh hahahaha![/glow] appreciation of one the God's beautiful creations? ;D bawal rin ba sa mga atheist yan jovell?
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Post by joes on May 24, 2006 13:37:39 GMT 8
let's talk about freewill!
if a devine being already knows what's instore for you, as if you are already predestined, what use do you have for freewill?
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Post by BrusKO on May 24, 2006 13:38:02 GMT 8
[glow=yellow,2,300]Joes, to add to your questions... Why do Believe in God's rules when you also think it's cool to see girls on skimpy clothes washing your car? AAAAh hahahaha![/glow] Just a question: did you stop believing in a god to emancipate yourself from a certain dogma; so that you yourself can feast your eyes on women with skimpy clothing or men washing cars? Quit taunting Christians and Catholics, Jovell. Just because you've seen a few of them behave that way, it doesn't mean all of them are like that. Joes, your arguments are valid but it won't hold water for too long. They're sweeping generalizations. Guys, ever heard of Ad Hominem? ;D
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