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Post by sleepygeepy on May 20, 2018 13:46:11 GMT 8
Hello Guys, I'm planning on buying a buying a mountain bike for general purpose riding and I wanted to try a 27.5+ bike for the plush ride and fun factor of having bigger tires. Initially I wanted a 29er, but for some weird reason the thought of riding a bike with oversized tires that can bulldoze through anything became appealing to me. To make matters worse I saw a guy out in the roads riding a plus sized mountain bike and I said to myself "holy @#$% that is one badass bike" and it really looked fun to ride haha! So I started looking into affordable mountain bikes with 27.5+ tires and sadly the pickings were slim. I could not go with the well known brands like Cannondale, Giant, Specialized, Marin, Surly etc because my budget was limited and I already overspent on a road-bike before. The budget China brands like TRINX, Foxter, Simplon, SAVA did not have a 27.5+ model (well there was one with dubious specs) and most were old 26er models or regular 27.5 models. Then I stumbled upon these two bikes which I believe are locally designed and developed... Sandugo BruskoMammoth SavageThe Sandugo Brusko initially retails for Php 35K but it dropped recently down to Php 20K. Specs are very modest like the drivetrain is mostly Shimano Altus paired with Shimano non-series hydraulic brakes but it's expected because of the price. What's interesting about this bike is the frame and fork are using boost spacing so it could be a good platform for future 27.5+ wheel upgrades? One thing I don't like is the solid aluminum fork and I'm not sure if 27.5+ tires are cushy enough that you can get away with it. Another thing that is disappointing is the bike is hard to find locally and you have to order it online, so there is no bike shop / support structure in place to help you with maintenance, repairs, or tuning. I'm not an experienced bike builder so this is a big concern for me. The Mammoth Savage on the other hand is a bit more expensive at Php 25K but the components look to be better. You get mostly Shimano Acera components, Tektro Auriga hydraulic brakes, and a decent looking Prowheel Hollowtech crank. The frame does not use boost spacing so you get the regular sized 100mm / 142mm hubs, not sure if that will be an issue for future wheel upgrades. Also the rims are like the ones used by fatbikes with the open slots along the rim. I don't know what is the benefit of those open slots (does it make the wheel lighter?) but the red color kinda spoils the look for me. There is a cheaper variant at Php 20K with a much nicer color scheme (black frame with white lettering) but the specs are lower than the black-red variant. What I really like about this bike is the bike shop specializes in fatbikes and I can tell the owner is passionate about bikes and there is a good FB community behind the shop. So I'm not too worried about maintenance, upgrades, and repairs since the bike shops seems pro-active. So I'm really torn between the two... the Sandugo Brusko looks nice and is cheaper, but I'm not sure if I will be able to upgrade it and look for a fork to replace the stock aluminum one. The Mammoth Savage on the other hand looks to be a safer buy but I'm not so sure about the rims and what are the possible wheel upgrades I can do with the bike. I'm ok with both having 27.5 x 2.8 inch tires now but personally I want to go with a bigger tire size if I have the budget. Which do you think is a better overall purchase? Any comments or suggestions that you can share is appreciated Or should I just go "ah to hell with it!" and go for an obnoxious but cool looking fatbike like this one... Mammoth Brutus Thanks!
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Post by simplej0ys on May 20, 2018 15:07:36 GMT 8
ask the owner if he'll be putting out boosted frames and forks. and yes, those holes are to lighten the wheel. and yes, they can use sealant.
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Post by 18650 on May 20, 2018 15:12:55 GMT 8
the savage looks interesting. but check for the availability of tires first. btw which shop is selling the bike?
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 20, 2018 15:29:59 GMT 8
Just to add... this is the more affordable black-white version that costs Php 20K. It looks nicer in my opinion but the component spec is lower than the black-red version. Mammoth Savage (Black White)I also inquired about these bikes below, but they are above my budget range. Note that the Cannondale Cujo 3 is using a boost ready aluminum frame while the Marin Pine Mountain is using a steel cromoly frame that is also boost ready. Cannondale Cujo 3 (Php 38.5K) Marin Pine Mountain (Php 45K)
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 20, 2018 15:35:30 GMT 8
the savage looks interesting. but check for the availability of tires first. btw which shop is selling the bike? 27.5 plus tires are available in some shops if you are looking for the 2.8-inch to 3.0 inch size. I have seen the Onza Canis 27.5 x 28.5 skin wall tires available locally (which looks awesome BTW) and also the WTB Trail Blazer tires of the same size. The bigger WTB Ranger 27.5 x 3.0 tire is also available and this is the tire I'm targeting to upgrade if it fits the frame and fork. The name of the bike shop is Whatta Bike and they specialize in fatbikes
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 20, 2018 15:47:19 GMT 8
ask the owner if he'll be putting out boosted frames and forks. and yes, those holes are to lighten the wheel. and yes, they can use sealant. I'll ask when I get the chance to pass by their shop, but it looks like all the frames and forks they have now use non-boost spacing. It would be nice if they can come out with a boost ready frame and a boost ready non-suspension fork made of steel or carbon. I don't know if boost ready solid forks are available (locally) but I would be interested in one since I rarely go trail riding and it would lighten the bike a bit. The shop does mention that the wheels and tires are tubeless ready but they are using inner tubes with their bikes for now.
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 20, 2018 15:53:16 GMT 8
Question regarding boost frames and forks... if the Mammoth Savage is using a non-boost ready frame and fork... does it mean I will have a hard time looking for 27.5+ wheelsets?
I'm not sure what is the status of "boost" components now if they are locally available and affordable, but I'm hoping the Mammoth Savage can be upgraded to a lighter 27.5+ wheelset with better hubs at least?
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Post by simplej0ys on May 20, 2018 17:10:06 GMT 8
i have ridden the Marin Pine Mountain and it was sweet to ride. CrMo is sweet!
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 20, 2018 18:23:33 GMT 8
Steel frames are nice, I wish I could afford those Surly or Salsa bikes. I'm wondering if Ave Maldea can fabricate steel frames for 27.5+ bikes... something like this perhaps:
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Post by 18650 on May 21, 2018 13:13:53 GMT 8
since the savage uses a non-boost 29er fork i wonder about the tire clearance w/ 2.8 tires?
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 21, 2018 15:19:42 GMT 8
since the savage uses a non-boost 29er fork i wonder about the tire clearance w/ 2.8 tires? I'm guessing the Maxxis Ikon 27.5x2.8 tires just happens to fit within the allotted clearance of the Suntour XCM 29er fork. I don't think there is more clearance for wider 27.5+ tires or for 2.8 tires with very aggressive knobby tread. What's interesting is someone was able to fit WTB Rangers (27.5x3.0) on the rear of the Mammoth Savage frame. The bike is using a different fork so I'm not sure if it has boost spacing...
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Post by 18650 on May 21, 2018 19:34:37 GMT 8
i'm really interested in buying one i'm assuming the Savage uses a threaded bottom bracket? would you happen to know the width? 68mm? the spec sheet also lists a Quanta QR 140mm rear hub. which is strange coz i've never heard of a 140mm if it's QR then it can't be a 12x142 thru-axle. i'm guessing it's just a standard 135mm QR
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 22, 2018 9:31:13 GMT 8
i'm really interested in buying one i'm assuming the Savage uses a threaded bottom bracket? would you happen to know the width? 68mm? the spec sheet also lists a Quanta QR 140mm rear hub. which is strange coz i've never heard of a 140mm if it's QR then it can't be a 12x142 thru-axle. i'm guessing it's just a standard 135mm QR I'm not sure... but I think the Savage frame is using a threaded bottom bracket. The higher spec variant is using a Prowheel bottom bracket and based on the specs of the Prowheel BB, the shell width is 68/73mm. Prowheel also has a BB92 bottom bracket available but chances are the Savage frame is using the threaded one which is more common on entry level bikes. The Quanta QR 140mm rear hub looks to be a typo. In newer posts on their FB page, they list the hubs as "Quanta Sealed Bearing Hubs, 142mm rear/ 100mm front, cricket sound" hehe...
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Post by 18650 on May 22, 2018 12:24:13 GMT 8
that's definitely QR. not a 142mm thru-axle. and it's not a fatbike QR hub. so at this point we're pretty sure it's the usual 135mm QR hub btw the tire clearance doesn't look very good at the chainstays
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 22, 2018 16:06:43 GMT 8
Ah, I didn't know that rear hubs with quick release skewers are only 135mm. Not sure why Whatta Bike is listing them as 142mm in the specs page... It's kind of hard to tell from the angle of the shot, but I think the 2.8-inch tire fits well in the frame with ample allowance for mud / debris to pass through. It could be that the 45mm rims they are using are making the tire profile wider instead of taller but I'm not sure. Here is a better picture of the 3.0-inch tire being installed on the rear end of the Mammoth Savage frame if it helps... looks to be a tight fit
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 22, 2018 16:12:08 GMT 8
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Post by hideki on May 22, 2018 20:58:33 GMT 8
wow. reading the posts here somehow compels me to N+1 haha. when brusko was just being teased, I got interested on it but when I found out that the price is too high for my capacity, I decided to move on. now, reading posts here, makes me want a brusko again. i hope we can buy it frameset only, and i do hope for another price drop. 😂
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 23, 2018 1:35:56 GMT 8
Yes I wish the Sandusko Brusko 27.5+ has a frame and fork only option, but unfortunately Sandugo is only selling it as a complete bike. What's nice though is the price drop from Php 35K to Php 21K and maybe this is in response to the China brands which are increasingly competitive in terms of price-to-specs. The Mammoth Savage is offered as a frame only option, but not sure how appealing that option is now we know the frame is not boost / through axle ready. I'm hoping the Sandusko Brusko still has the black or blue colored version in stock. What I was hoping to build is more of an adventure type / backpacking type bike with fat tires, low gears for climbing, and the option to add maybe 1-2 small racks for securing a small bag or backpack I saw this Sandugo Brusko build which is similar to what I had in mind. The bike looks a bit weird and probably ugly to some, but I'm sure it looks better in person and it grows on you the more you look at it. I can visualize this bike with the black-grey colored frame, a 2x10 drive train, fat 3.0 inch skinwall tires, a small rack up front, small rack behind the seat, a couple of bottle cages, and a comfy brooks saddle to top it off... Sandugo Brusko Custom Pre-Built (Small size Php 25K)
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 23, 2018 2:04:00 GMT 8
Since we are discussing local mid-fats, this is another option I was looking at... the Tutubi Carabao frameset. I think it is a locally designed / locally made CroMoly steel frame that is compatible with 650b plus or 29er wheelsets. You can build a beautiful fat plus adventure / backpacking rig around this frame. Unfortunately building a bike with this frame is out of my price range Tutubi Carabao Frame (Php 12K)
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Post by spyghost on May 23, 2018 8:06:38 GMT 8
the brusko posted is already an old model. i'm not sure if there's still stock of this.
they got a new one known as kalasag which is spec'd as 29er.
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Post by sleepygeepy on May 23, 2018 14:41:21 GMT 8
the brusko posted is already an old model. i'm not sure if there's still stock of this. they got a new one known as kalasag which is spec'd as 29er. There are some shops that still have the Sandugo Brusko in stock, but color choice and sizing is limited. I reached out to a couple of bike shops and so far only two confirmed (through PM) that they still have stock of Sandugo Brusko. Curiously, two different bike shops are selling their remaining Sandugo Brusko bikes as pre-upgraded builds and come with higher specs and price. I saw the Sandugo Kalasag and I'm really underwhelmed by it. I believe Sandugo Cycling is attempting to compete with budget brands like TRINX, Foxter, Simplon, etc and it's hard to see what makes their bike stand out from the rest. Sad to say, my impression of the Sandugo Kalasag is another entry level mountain bike in a market overcrowded with sub Php 10K mountain bikes. I wish they came out with something different and unique just like the Sandugo Brusko. They could have come up with something like... - A monster-cross bike or gravel bike with flared dropbars or h-style handlebars - A steel framed bike with plus size tires or even a fatbike - A 29er or 26er midfat with plus size tires (29x3.0 or 26x3.0) Anyway I do hope Sandugo Cycling come up with more unique and outstanding bikes that follow their extreme adventure theme.
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Post by jrocket803 on May 23, 2018 19:21:06 GMT 8
Since we are discussing local mid-fats, this is another option I was looking at... the Tutubi Carabao frameset. I think it is a locally designed / locally made CroMoly steel frame that is compatible with 650b plus or 29er wheelsets. You can build a beautiful fat plus adventure / backpacking rig around this frame. Unfortunately building a bike with this frame is out of my price range Tutubi Carabao Frame (Php 12K) Good looking bike
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Post by sk8er_saix on Jun 5, 2018 8:20:48 GMT 8
Full rigid bikes in this thread makes me moist.
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Post by xtrshadow on Jun 22, 2018 1:36:42 GMT 8
as far as im aware, theres a sandugo brusko mkii frame..question is when will they sell it. one shortcoming ng brusko 1 is that 3.0 tyres isnt advisable sa likod.
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Post by hideki on Jun 24, 2018 12:24:30 GMT 8
uy magkakaron pala mk 2 ng brusko, kelan kaya ito.. hmmmm
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Post by sleepygeepy on Jun 26, 2018 5:03:07 GMT 8
as far as im aware, theres a sandugo brusko mkii frame..question is when will they sell it. one shortcoming ng brusko 1 is that 3.0 tyres isnt advisable sa likod. That's nice to hear, hope they bring out the MK II soon. I wish our local brands and builders (Sandugo, Rurok, Tutubi, The Project, MOB, Whattabike, Nyfti, Ave Maldea etc) come up with frames that can fit a 27.5 x 3.8 tire or a 29 x 3.0 tire comfortably, that would be something. If they use a steel cromoly frame and fork with boost spacing even better. We already have affordable 40mm - 50mm rims and boost hubs from Tutubi so building a decent plus size wheelset should not be too expensive. I was looking at The Project bikes and components and they have really cool bikes with that urban theme. I mean just look at this Cyclocross type commuter with a badass name... Harabas!I can only hope they make a similar MTB XC style or adventure type steel frame with 29 x 3.0 wheels...
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Post by sleepygeepy on Jun 26, 2018 5:15:50 GMT 8
Saw this beautiful unfinished build in one of the for sale ads in FB... credits to the owner Specs Frame: Tutubi Carabao Cockpit: La Bici bars, stem, seat post Fork: La Bici Carbon 29er Wheelset: Novatec D781SB front hubs, Novatec d772SB rear hubs with pillar spokes on Tutubi 50mm rims Tires: Maxxis Chronicle 27.5+ x 3.0 front and Maxxis iKON+ 27.5+ x 2.8 rear
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Post by jrocket803 on Jul 30, 2018 18:25:36 GMT 8
Saw this beautiful unfinished build in one of the for sale ads in FB... credits to the owner Specs Frame: Tutubi Carabao Cockpit: La Bici bars, stem, seat post Fork: La Bici Carbon 29er Wheelset: Novatec D781SB front hubs, Novatec d772SB rear hubs with pillar spokes on Tutubi 50mm rims Tires: Maxxis Chronicle 27.5+ x 3.0 front and Maxxis iKON+ 27.5+ x 2.8 rear Good looking frame
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Post by sleepygeepy on Sept 16, 2018 2:57:16 GMT 8
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verblkint
Free Rider
You must defeat Sheng Long to stand a chance.
Posts: 291
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Post by verblkint on Sept 16, 2018 3:13:12 GMT 8
Head angle is really slack but the reach numbers are a bit short. Truth be told, the potential target market for this frame is probably looking at the seat tube length numbers as opposed to the reach when thinking of size. In comparison, my hardtail has a 420mm reach but it is a Medium. My other bike has a similar reach number (415 mm) but it is a size small. Seat tube angle is a bit too low though, a really effective climber is typically in the 75 degree range and up. What I do think is that this wasn't meant to climb on. This bike would play well as a trail bike and would be a good one to use on steep descents and rocky fire roads. If someone wants to enduro on a hardtail, this frame would be a good place to start.
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