|
Post by Onie on Jun 10, 2007 20:59:11 GMT 8
Once you get to see this sign on bikes late this year or early 2008, it's Dave's new system called Split Pivot, featuring worldwide patent pending concentric dropout pivot technology never seen before. A web site dedicated to the system, www.split-pivot.com, was launched earlier in May 2007. News on licensees coming, the bikes in the pictures above are actual 2008 models, been in the prototype and verification stages for some time now. Details on brands and models to come soon. World-wide release late 2007 and early 2008! As Dave himself would say, Ride for fun! Time out! Let's all read along now! Tata! Split Pivot, Split-Pivot.com, and Ride for fun! are pending trademarks of Split Pivot Inc.
|
|
j0
Newbie
Posts: 31
|
Post by j0 on Jun 10, 2007 22:30:08 GMT 8
Is Trek licensing this and marketing it under the "Active Braking Pivot" name? Truly looks a bit like the new Fuel: Well, to wrap up things here: So these days we have four-bar linkages, faux-bar linkages, VPP, single-pivot, Monolink, Equilink, etc., etc., etc. Trek now adds yet another line to the list with its novel Active Braking Pivot (ABP) rear end which places a dropout pivot concentric with the rear hub axle instead of above or below it. The new Fuel EX is still a single-pivot design speaking strictly in terms of axle path, but Trek claims ABP greatly improves the braking performance of the rear end as the additional pivot effectively turns the non-driveside seat stay into a floating brake mount.
|
|
|
Post by Alphabolt on Jun 11, 2007 18:47:44 GMT 8
Wow...thinking outside the "triangle" NICE !
|
|
|
Post by clutchshooter on Jun 13, 2007 19:46:29 GMT 8
And my first thought when I saw those two was...
"bring on the lawyers"!!!
But who knows... Well, Trek might just be one of the companies to use the split-pivot patent and pay the royalties...
|
|
j0
Newbie
Posts: 31
|
Post by j0 on Jun 13, 2007 19:51:22 GMT 8
But what I'm thinking that if Trek were paying for the rights to use the design they would be calling it the same thing. Like all of the other dw designed bikes that have the "dwlink" logo somewhere on the frame such as the Mojo my friend.
With that being said, I don't really think they're paying dw for the new rear pivot design. If they were they would probably be calling it the same thing. And at this point they're not, the dw is referred to as the split pivot and it appears trek's has been dubbed the abp (active braking pivot).
I think I smell a legal battle in the making!! It's going to be a long day for the lawyers!
Now we can sit back and watch the fun begin! ;D
|
|
|
Post by clutchshooter on Jun 13, 2007 20:07:29 GMT 8
LOL! Can no longer wait!!! ;D
|
|
j0
Newbie
Posts: 31
|
Post by j0 on Jun 13, 2007 21:26:35 GMT 8
I don't see anything wrong with Trek licensing the new dw design particularly for improving their bikes. I for one applaud Trek for stepping up their game too... It's just when I saw the new design I thought, that's a cool innovation and look it's called active braking pivot (trademark'd by Trek) and I was pretty stoked at the way the new bike's design. Actually, it's not their design, that's big deal for me, in the name of innovation I am all for it. I am just slighly turned off by the fact that they are calling it something different if they are indeed paying for the rights to use it. But hey, if that's what is paramount for Trek to step up their game as far as fs design goes, more power to them!!!
|
|
|
Post by anthrax76 on Jun 14, 2007 14:20:46 GMT 8
we'll never know, maybe Trek bought the rights, similar to what Specialized did with FSR.
|
|
|
Post by >rocketman> on Jun 14, 2007 19:12:54 GMT 8
But there's no legal battle happened with giant's maestro and dave weagle's dw link
I like to see the upcoming a Split pivot dh/fr bike from dave weagle.
(dave weagle designed the famous ih sunday)
|
|
|
Post by Onie on Jun 14, 2007 19:51:22 GMT 8
I think Clutch is right on the money, the lawyers are going to have a field day with this one. Only thing I notice is that it appears Trek got a production ready bike whereas the Dave's design is still in its prototype stages. But what I'm thinking that if Trek were paying for the rights to use the design they would be calling it the same thing. Like all of the other dw designed bikes that have the "dwlink" logo somewhere on the frame such as the Mojo my friend. With that being said, I don't really think they're paying dw for the new rear pivot design. If they were they would probably be calling it the same thing. And at this point they're not, the dw is referred to as the split pivot and it appears trek's has been dubbed the abp (active braking pivot). I think I smell a legal battle in the making!! It's going to be a long day for the lawyers! Now we can sit back and watch the fun begin! ;D Case-to-case basis___________________________________________________________________________________________________It depends with the licensing terms - somewhat uniQue for every case. Sometimes you are forced to use the name, stick a logo, & stuff. Well, at times, you just pay to use it. Take this, Cannondale licenses the BB30 standard that is used by Specialized but they make it look like it's their own invention without any mention of Cannondale and the BB30 name... Just learned from my network, the Trek system does look like a replica to Dave's SP. Now we wait to see who applied for the patent first. Dave always has his projects on a row when he designs stuff so my chips are on Dave for this! But this has got me so interested though I will certainly be reaching my friend who got a network of reps 'morrow to get the lowdown.
|
|
|
Post by pjax on Jun 22, 2007 22:45:42 GMT 8
i wonder what "the DW" has to say about this, considering he still has the DW*link.
|
|
j0
Newbie
Posts: 31
|
Post by j0 on Jun 23, 2007 9:24:28 GMT 8
Here's what i got from our local rep here, Trek licensed their abp (active braking pivot), a replica of SP from dw.
Now, we all could avoid losing sleep over it!!! ;D
|
|
|
Post by Onie on Jun 23, 2007 11:55:40 GMT 8
Yay! Onie I think I have to retract this one (my own quote): Only thing I notice is that it appears Trek got a production ready bike whereas the Dave's design is still in its prototype stages. Here's Dave's testament... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I've been working on this for years. Been riding prototypes, the bikes on the Split-Pivot.com site are 2008 production models for 2 different manufacturers. Basically it is a single pivot for acceleration purposes with a floating brake and shock actuation combined. In no way is it a replacement for dw-link, I intended it to be an alternative that could be easily and cheaply produced. The silver lining to me is that we can use single pivot placement for acceleration that would be terrible for braking under normal circumstances and use the floating brake to eliminate the braking issues. It's not the holy grail, but it will make a pretty d@mn nice bike. Better than a single pivot but not dw-link.So there you have it! The scoop on the NEW Split-Pivot design. Just to add as well: From what I've inferred, it's a hybrid of Mono-pivot & DW-Link (open for corrections). Monopivot pedaling is well-suited for downhill bike design where pedaling is normally at higher gear ratio speeds. Downside for monopivot design: limits the ability to produce efficent low geared pedaling with freely active bump compliance usually during uphill portions of the ride. Well, that's where DW-Link would come in, AFAIK. As the result of the marrying of these two systems, paves way for the rear wheel pivoting on the floating link of a concentric dropout “ split-pivot” design. Thereby producing monopivot pedaling reactivity with separated floating (virtual pivot) braking geometry. Just imagine a heckler with 'brake therapy' installed on it. But this time, with SP you've got a complete package already! That is no need to buy a floating brake mechanism. Hence, lighter & more elegant looking. There you go, who needs brake therapy?
|
|
|
Post by clutchshooter on Jun 23, 2007 12:03:02 GMT 8
My riding bud back here could'ave sworn to detest his monopivot bike. Let's not mention his bike to avoid hurting others here! ;D
He once said this kickback and stalling reaction to high monopivot suspension on rougher climbs was what lead him to the long search for a bike that could maintain pedaling momentum in the rough like a low monopivot AND accelerate like a high monopivot. A good Horst link (not the medium-low monopivot emulating ICT @#$%) works pretty well and was best until the dw-Link. The dw-Link bikes pedal in all condtions amazingly well even with low end shocks.
|
|
|
Post by Onie on Jun 23, 2007 12:09:38 GMT 8
My riding bud back here could'ave sworn to detest his monopivot bike. Let's not mention his bike to avoid hurting others here! ;D He once said this kickback and stalling reaction to high monopivot suspension on rougher climbs was what lead him to the long search for a bike that could maintain pedaling momentum in the rough like a low monopivot AND accelerate like a high monopivot. A good Horst link (not the medium-low monopivot emulating ICT @#$%) works pretty well and was best until the dw-Link. The dw-Link bikes pedal in all condtions amazingly well even with low end shocks. Going uphill over rough terrain is exactly where you need some traction. Despite being out of shape for the longest time, it's simply amazing what kind of climbs I can claw up on my bike while maintaining traction. I'd suggest (for your bud) looking at the DW-link bikes or the Giant Maestro-design. It's good stuff! Avoid VPP as they use chain tension for pedaling too, although sometimes the tradeoff isn't quite as bad.
|
|